San Francisco Film Critics Winners

[Steph2]

Well, when there isn't much to give up...

LOL. I hate you.

[cam]

I will grant you, Damien, that La Vie En Rose is one dreadful film, but Cotillard brought it out that realm. I can think of any number of incredibly horrible films that had one splendid performance, which was rewarded. Do you want me to start?

[cam]

[quote="ITALIANO"][/quote]
Shit, Marc. Let's not refer to Cotillard's performance or anyone else's to THAT dreadful ham, Benigni. It is the kiss of death.

[Big Magilla]

Of course Marion Cotillard is no Susan Hayward. That was the point.

[ITALIANO]

Jean-Louis Trintignant, one of the most internal, subtle actors ever--has never won a César award.

Yes, exactly - but that's a true scandal, because Trintignant is objectively one of the best actors that France has ever produced. And they like him, of course, they are proud of him - but when it comes to awards or other public recognitions, they often prefer to be "amazed", to be left open mouthed, and even if some performances might be a bit artificial, a bit mechanical, they don't find it difficult to forgive it. This may be how they reveal their Latin side, probably - and since we are talking about the Cesars, it's a kind of national joke how often Isabelle Huppert gets nominated, yet she has won only once, not for one of her most famous performances even. But I mean, we all love France, don't we?

[Penelope]

is admittedly showy, but in a very French way - they love this kind of "big", sometimes exhausting, tour-de-forces, they have written countless plays and screenplays with that in mind. One is allowed not to like it of course - and for example I'd pick any Isabelle Huppert's performance over, let's say, Isabelle Adjani in Camille Claudel (just to mention two much admired, very different French actresses)

This is very true; and it's telling that our mutual favorite French actor--Jean-Louis Trintignant, one of the most internal, subtle actors ever--has never won a César award. And Cotillard has, for her Supporting turn in A Very Long Engagement.

[Uri]

I found A Mighty Heart to be a rather boring, uninvolving docudrama which has nothing interesting to say about the conflict it was set against, and accordingly, all that the actors were required to do was posing while projecting basic, mostly distressed, expressions. Anyone competent enough not to bump into the furniture would do, so Jolie fitted just fine. The only time I felt there was something more to her performance was when Mariane's rather dishy brother appears briefly and she seems to actually relate to him (something she couldn't manage to convey with Futterman), but maybe it had something to do with the off-screen stuff associated with her I must shamefully admit I'm aware of.



Edited By Uri on 1197469988

[ITALIANO]

Are you all on drugs? Seriously. I mean, comparing Marion Cotillard to Susan Hayward is absurd - these two actresses couldn't be more different. Cotillard's performance - which I think could have been much more impressive had the movie been better - is admittedly showy, but in a very French way - they love this kind of "big", sometimes exhausting, tour-de-forces, they have written countless plays and screenplays with that in mind. One is allowed not to like it of course - and for example I'd pick any Isabelle Huppert's performance over, let's say, Isabelle Adjani in Camille Claudel (just to mention two much admired, very different French actresses) - but before another legend starts on this board, it's NOT a Susan Hayward-style performance - not all foreign things have an American equivalent (though it may be easier for you to think so) and this, quite simply, hasn't one. Anyone who thinks he knows France and French culture shouldn't make this big mistake, really - Marion Cotillard's performance is "French grandeur" at its most typical. And - I repeat this before being attacked - this doesn't mean that you have to like it, actually I can perfectly understand those who find it a bit "too much" - it is, even by Italian standards. But culturally it belongs to THAT acting tradition, and you have to judge it on those terms (a bit like a certain Italian actor of a few years ago). The French love to be impressed by their actors, and they often forgive them that kind of excesses that in a more realistic, naturalistic context - like the American one - would be considered to be inappropriate. It's a chamaleontic display of acting virtuosism - which one is free to reject, or to admire but not enjoy, but it hasn't aything to do with American movie stars of the 50s.

Basically, Susan Hayward was always playing Susan Hayward - yes, I know, she was Jane Froman and then Lillian Roth and then Barbara Graham, but she never let you forget for a moment that she was always Susan Hayward with her typical (and back then beloved by many) mannerisms. Marion Cotillard, as Original BJ says (and he thinks it's a bad thing) "never even felt like the same person from scene to scene". I'm not sure that this is true (or unintentional), and if it is, it's more a problem of the movie itself, but this is the proof that we are not in Susan Hayward territory - definitely not.

Unfortunately I still haven't seen A Mighty Heart but considering Jolie's and Cotillard's previous work, I honestly find it difficult to believe that Jolie - till now a never very impressive actress - is suddenly an Eleonora Duse compared to "the French ham" (Cotillard was very good in a small role in another flawed French epic, A Very Long Engagement). VERY difficult. But I will hopefully get to see A Mighty Heart soon and decide.

What do I think of Marion Cotillard? It's not my kind of performance, but I sort of admire it - you can see the talent behind it (if - again - you understand the cultural context it comes from). It's the movie that it's full of problems - episodic, disconnected, irritating even, and annoyingly anxious to be liked by the Americans - but her performance sometimes triumphs over it - which wasn't easy. Does she deserve an Oscar? No, but for different reasons than those I've read on this thread. It's not that I didn't like to see Cotillard criticized, I just didn't like to see her criticized in the wrong way.



Edited By ITALIANO on 1197468323

[OscarGuy]

Jolie is better than I expected in A Mighty Heart. I think she is quite good in her quiet scenes as Magilla said. What strikes me about the first scene magilla mentions is that it feels so out of the ordinary for the character. After most of the movie putting on a brave face and not overreacting when she first learns that pearl might be dead only to find out he's not, then it seems out of place. Why overreact at the end, but not the first time. It doesn't make sense.

[Akash]

I would give up boys for Angelina Jolie!

Well, when there isn't much to give up...

[Steph2]

And I must be the only guy on the planet who doesn't think she's that hot.

You're nuts Aakash. I would give up boys for Angelina Jolie!

I've also seen A Mighty Heart and must agree with Damien, she's wonderful in it! Though yeah, her Oscar win, not so much.

[Big Magilla]

I kind of liked Jolie in A Mighty Heart, though that wail of hers when they come to tell her they've found her husand is as Oscar bait-y as anything I've ever seen and that birthing scene was the most extraneous scene in any film this year - again designed to draw attention to Jolie's histionics. I thought she was much better in the film's quiet scenes - her best performance since the TV movie, Gia.

Damien, you simply must see Cotillard in Ridley Scott's A Good Year opposite Russell Crowe to appreciate her "range".

[Akash]

I will say right now -- without having seen A Mighty Heart -- that I have never understood the appeal of Angelina Jolie. I've never seen her give a fully convincing performance, and most of what she's done has actually been quite horrible. Her Oscar for Girl, Interrupted is among the worst acting choices the Academy has ever made, and especially considering that she topped Catherine Keener and Chloe Sevigny.

And I must be the only guy on the planet who doesn't think she's that hot.

[Damien]

I think Angelina Jolie is quite impressive in A Mighty Heart. She's certainly more accomplished than the French ham who made the Little Sparrow seem like a big ol' turkey buzzard.

[paperboy]

And Hayward didn't hog the camera either. She lets Thelma Ritter steal whole scenes from her...

"Lets"?

Thelma Ritter is the most accomplished scene stealer in movies.