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Posted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 5:27 pm
by jack
I second OscarGuy's post. If Inception does become a boxoffice behemoth then hopefully we can put the bed the shit-fest of summer movies like Transformers and Pirates of the Caribbean.
Posted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 4:43 pm
by OscarGuy
Never let the initial impact on imdb color your thoughts of where it will end up. A lot of films start off that high as the bigger fans of the film post their thoughts with due diligence. It's the coming weeks and post-DVD voters that will likely even the film out to its final position.
I don't think it's one of the ten greatest films of all time, but it's definitely the kind of film I want more of from Hollywood. If audiences can keep getting these smart actioners, maybe we can get back to a time (like the '70s and '80s) where smart action films are the rule and not the exception.
Posted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 4:06 pm
by rolotomasi99
Well, I loved it! I went in with high expectations and it exceeded them. However, unlike so many here, I did not go in expecting a Charlie Kaufman/art house type film which would delve into the nature of dreams, the psyche, etc. I just went in expecting a smarter than usual action film. On that level, INCEPTION was brilliant.
To me, INCEPTION is no different than SALT (hero working to prove themselves innocent of murder) or THE INSIDE MAN (heist film). It is just a really smart version of those types of films. Much like SHUTTER ISLAND earlier this year, INCEPTION was a B-grade type of film handled with care by an A-grade creative team. I did not expect any more than that so I was happy the film was able to deliver.
I agree with Mister Tee, some people went into it expecting Antonioni. Of course you would be disappointed if this is what you thought the film was supposed to be. I also love Mister Tee's line about faulting JAWS for not being as good as MOBY DICK. Much like JAWS, INCEPTION was just a particularly smart and well made summer popcorn flick.
I think some folks here, much like the print critics, are just having a negative reaction to the fanboy hype. I absolutely do not think this is the third best film of all time (according to imdb users), but I do think it is one of the greatest action/heist films of all times. It should be enjoyed on that level.
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 11:52 pm
by Sabin
How do you differentiate between "ramblings of a fanboy" and an opinion from someone who loved the film?
Rather than explain a basic criteria for differentiation, I would say that anybody who claims that Inception is a metaphor for how Nolan works as a director is a fanboy. And if this person extrapolates that ultimately what Christopher Nolan is saying that catharsis found in a dream is the same as in life and dreams...well, I'll tell you what. If that IS what Nolan is saying, then it only confirms the ultimate philosophical banality of the film. Either way, it's not a pretty picture.
I'm wondering just what Sonic and Sabin went in expecting -- Antonioni?
I'm going to see it again within the week, but I was dumbstruck for much of it by what I saw as egregious emotional and thematic shortcomings, narrative lopsidedness, and atonality. I'm a big Nolan fan, and I saw a lot that I hate about those filmmakers that those of my generation praise for taking "everything into consideration" like Paul Thomas Anderson. Which is to say resultant in somewhat stifling productions. I found Inception stiflingly constructed and hollow at its core. The latter part is what disturbs me because I think Memento is as incredibly devastating an experience as Inception is distanced.
...but I'm going to see it again.
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:19 pm
by Sonic Youth
Mister Tee wrote:I'm wondering just what Sonic and Sabin went in expecting -- Antonioni?
No, I was just expecting that all the ideas and philosophies Nolan's mouthpieces were continuously babbling about would be depicted visually. I wasn't expecting it to be the aesthetic equivalent of an overwrought episode of 24. As far as I'm concerned, true imaginative cinema should be "Show much while explaining [in words] little." I felt I was sitting through the longest Hollywood pitch meeting, not a piece of cinema.
But I will concede that I didn't see it under the best of circumstances. I was at an IMAX theater, and this movie was not made for IMAX. For me, films best suited for IMAX utilize space, and color and contrast. Inception doesn't do this. Visually, it's cramped and grey, and the overwhelming IMAX screen emphasized these qualities. Maybe it plays better on a regular screen. (It also didn't help that this particular theater had a huge on-screen light show with pounding "Squirel Nut Zippers" music before the film.)
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:58 pm
by Mister Tee
I don't have the energy to go into it in any detail now, but I enjoyed the hell out of it. There's banality at the heart of the Dicaprio/Cotillard element, but not enough to offset all the kinetic pleasure offered along the way. It's a little too long, but, unlike Dark Knight, it didn't unexpectedly start a third act just when the auduence was ready for an epilogue -- you knew you'd have to stay inside the dreams until things were resolved, and once they were, the screen went to black.
I thought the effects were pretty amazing, and very few seemed conceived purely in terms of "this'll look cool" -- the story felt like it preceded the set pieces, a rarity in modern summer Hollywood. Oh -- and how nice to see a summer movie that was self-contained...didn't include a teaser for a sequel.
I'm wondering just what Sonic and Sabin went in expecting -- Antonioni? It's strictly pop movie-making, and I don't spend all that much time contemplating the film's "deep ideas". (I also don't find it as confusing as many critics seem to) David Denby griped that the movie's dreams don't have the quality of Bunuel's -- which to me is like faulting Jaws for not having Moby Dick's prose styling. Is it because Nolan once made Memento, people go in with higher levels of demand? I gave that up after Batman Begins. He's strictly a commercial-meister, but a highly imaginative one (for me, this movie runs rings around Avatar). I can't remember a summer movie I enjoyed this much.
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 11:54 am
by anonymous1980
Sabin wrote:So, I stopped reading after this quote because it occurred to me that I was reading the ramblings of a fanboy.
How do you differentiate between "ramblings of a fanboy" and an opinion from someone who loved the film?
Edited By anonymous on 1279558499
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 2:57 am
by Sabin
I read through the article that anonymous posted and I want to isolate the following quotation:
The film is a metaphor for the way that Nolan as a director works, and what he's ultimately saying is that the catharsis found in a dream is as real as the catharsis found in a movie is as real as the catharsis found in life. Inception is about making movies, and cinema is the shared dream that truly interests the director.
So, I stopped reading after this quote because it occurred to me that I was reading the ramblings of a fanboy. There may be an ounce of truth to this hyperbole, but the true irony of this statement of catharsis-as-cinema-as-shared dream is that everyone who leaves Inception will be sparked with the idea for a better movie. Christopher Nolan isn't sparked by communion, but rather the opposite. He's drawn to what tears people apart in film after film.
I don't buy it.
I'm wondering what's taking the rest of you so long. I've been waiting all weekend for someone to call me crazy.
Shutter Island is a better movie. Not >>> better, but probably just one >. It's far more engrossing on a moment-by-moment basis and understands nightmare logic in a visceral fashion that Nolan can't be bothered with. Shutter Island is a dumb movie, but it's a dumb movie with a lot of panache. Whereas Shutter Island [almost entirely] transcends its material, Inception is albatrossed by stoned dorm logic. Neither is terribly good, and yet somebody out there needs to edit both films together to produce a falling down masterpiece.
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:54 am
by anonymous1980
Sonic Youth wrote:Bog wrote:Sonic Youth wrote:In honor of Armond White's year-end round up,
In the category of mind-bending dream fantasias starring Leo DiCaprio in 2010:
Shutter Island >>> Inception
Fuck you, Christopher Nolan. Fuck you very much. Never again!
Well now I can't wait to see this bad boy...I hated Shutter Island
Sonic, maybe you were a huge fan of Shutter Island, and I can restore some hope for this flick?
Careful. It may still end up Shutter Island >>> Inception, and you'll be even worse off.
I'm wondering what's taking the rest of you so long. I've been waiting all weekend for someone to call me crazy.
You're crazy.
Don't listen to ravings of this lunatic. Inception was awesome.
Happy?
Here's a fascinating on one interpretation of Inception which I found raised some interesting points.
Edited By anonymous on 1279519805
Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:10 am
by Sonic Youth
Bog wrote:Sonic Youth wrote:In honor of Armond White's year-end round up,
In the category of mind-bending dream fantasias starring Leo DiCaprio in 2010:
Shutter Island >>> Inception
Fuck you, Christopher Nolan. Fuck you very much. Never again!
Well now I can't
wait to see this bad boy...I hated Shutter Island
Sonic, maybe you were a huge fan of Shutter Island, and I can restore some hope for this flick?
Careful. It may still end up Shutter Island >>> Inception, and you'll be even worse off.
I'm wondering what's taking the rest of you so long. I've been waiting all weekend for someone to call me crazy.
Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 8:02 pm
by Bog
Sonic Youth wrote:In honor of Armond White's year-end round up,
In the category of mind-bending dream fantasias starring Leo DiCaprio in 2010:
Shutter Island >>> Inception
Fuck you, Christopher Nolan. Fuck you very much. Never again!
Well now I can't wait to see this bad boy...I hated Shutter Island
Sonic, maybe you were a huge fan of Shutter Island, and I can restore some hope for this flick?
Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:14 am
by anonymous1980
I'm a Nolan skeptic. I thought his earlier films were all solid efforts but never great. I didn't like Batman Begins.
That said, I think Inception is his best work to date. Blew me away. And it's way better than The Matrix in my book.
Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:15 pm
by Sonic Youth
I didn't hate it. But I don't remember much of it at all, unlike the first Iron Man and Spider Man movies. I did hate the first one, and I don't find either of them fully cimematic. And for that matter, except for a few ooo-cool! special effects, Inception isn't all that cinematic either, especially for a movie about dreams.
Edited By Sonic Youth on 1279405246
Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:06 pm
by Sabin
I forget. Did you like The Dark Knight, SY?
Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 4:59 pm
by Sonic Youth
In honor of Armond White's year-end round up,
In the category of mind-bending dream fantasias starring Leo DiCaprio in 2010:
Shutter Island >>> Inception
Fuck you, Christopher Nolan. Fuck you very much. Never again!