Green Book reviews

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Big Magilla » Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:27 pm

A BlackKklansman actor speaks:

My wife Pamela and I just finished watching Green Book and although I don’t usually do this, I am compelled to drop this note to thank the filmmakers for having made this film for us all to see. I knew Don Shirley, and, in fact, had an office across the street from his at Carnegie Hall, and I experienced much of what he did at the same time. This movie is accurate, it is true, and it’s a wonderful movie that everyone should see.

The few people who appear to be objecting to the film’s depiction of the time and the man are dead wrong, and, if the basis of their resentment stems from it having been written and/or directed by someone who isn’t African American, I disagree with them even more. There are many perspectives from which to tell the same story and all can be true.

I personally thank the filmmakers for having told this important story from a very different lens, one no less compelling than any other.
So again, I say to the filmmakers, thank you, and congratulations.

Harry Belafonte

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Sabin » Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:53 pm

Precious Doll wrote
I've always felt Driving Miss Daisy has been unfairly dismissed over the decades. Whilst lacks the electrical power of Lee's film it is nevertheless, a gentle, thoughtful, well written, acted and directed piece. Best Picture material: Na but a ride I enjoyed taking. Have no idea how it stands up in 2019 but I suspect better than most of the films nominated in this years Best Picture slate.

It's absolutely unfairly dismissed. I honestly think the people who hate it haven't seen it or misremember it. I honestly don't think they get that she is a hypocritical Jewish liberal and the film doesn't let her off the hook for her hypocrisies.

I haven't seen it in ages but I'm sure it's still a very good movie. Just not the best film of 1989 not the best of the nominees either. But it doesn't deserve to go down as the "Oscar Travesty" of the Decade any more than Shakespeare in Love did in the 1990's.
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Big Magilla » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:03 am

The fallacy in Morris' argument is in the title of his piece. These feel-good racial reconciliation movies are not fantasies. Driving Miss Daisy , The Blind Side and Green Book are all based on real-life experiences. Maybe they are sugarcoated more than they should be, but they are told in the case of both Driving Miss Daisy and Green Book through the lens of a family member passing down his or her remembrances to a younger family member.

There is a real argument to be made about the success of these films vis-à-vis the success of films that show life through the eyes of black people who overcome their struggles through their own strength. This year there were more realistic films about the black experience than Green Book, Black Panther and even BlackKklansman with its tacked on "I told off David Duke" ending, but they're not in the running for a Best Picture Oscar.

If Beale Street Could Talk, which is set in the past, is one. The Hate U Give is another. There is no more powerful film about racial relations in today's world than that one. Years from now, maybe it will come to be regarded more highly than the Oscar nominees the way Do the Right Thing is now regarded more highly than Driving Miss Daisy and going back even further, the way Sidney Poitier's struggling everyman in A Raisin in the Sun is more highly regarded in the actor's filmography than either of his Oscar nominated performances in The Defiant Ones and Lilies of the Field (for which he won).

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby OscarGuy » Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:18 am

I still unabashedly love Driving Miss Daisy.
Wesley Lovell
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Precious Doll » Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:54 am

Sabin wrote:
"And yet viewed separately from the cold shower of “Do the Right Thing,” “Driving Miss Daisy” does operate with more finesse, elegance and awareness than my teenage self wanted to see. It’s still not the best movie of 1989. But it does know the southern caste system and the premium that system placed on propriety."



I've always felt Driving Miss Daisy has been unfairly dismissed over the decades. Whilst lacks the electrical power of Lee's film it is nevertheless, a gentle, thoughtful, well written, acted and directed piece. Best Picture material: Na but a ride I enjoyed taking. Have no idea how it stands up in 2019 but I suspect better than most of the films nominated in this years Best Picture slate.
Last edited by Precious Doll on Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Sabin » Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:48 am

I really like this piece by Wesley Morris.


Why Do the Oscars Keep Falling for Racial Reconciliation Fantasies?

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/23/arts ... dship.html

A few pulls:

"And yet viewed separately from the cold shower of “Do the Right Thing,” “Driving Miss Daisy” does operate with more finesse, elegance and awareness than my teenage self wanted to see. It’s still not the best movie of 1989. But it does know the southern caste system and the premium that system placed on propriety."

"Mahershala Ali is acting Shirley’s isolation and glumness, but the movie determines that dining with racists is better than dining alone. The money buys Don relative safety, friendship, transportation and a walking-talking black college. What the money can’t buy him is more of the plot in his own movie. It can’t allow him to bask in his own unique, uniquely dreamy artistry. It can’t free him from a movie that sits him where Miss Daisy sat, yet treats him worse than Hoke. He’s a literal passenger on this white man’s trip. Tony learns he really likes black people. And thanks to Tony, now so does Don."

I could keep posting...
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Sabin » Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:49 am

PreciousDoll wrote
I was dreading this film (pushed it forward from a proposed Monday screening to today) and as clunky and amateurish as it largely was it was a very easy viewing experience. None of it rings true and we go from one cliche to the next for two hours. What does make it easy to watch is that Farrelly moves things along quickly (the 130 minutes speed by) and co-leads Mahershala Ali & Viggo Mortensen whilst giving rather broad performances are both very agreeable in the film and manage to rise above a sea of mediocracy. Can't help but give them credit for that because its easier for an actor to do great work in a great film that to do goodish work in a lesser film.

Still, the film including the actors have no business being considered for awards and this is the first film I have seen since Roma that had more than 10 people at the screening.

This is more or less my take although I am bothered by how their journeys are written, how a false equivalency is drawn between Tony needing to not be racist but Shirley needing to loosing up and get in touch with his people. Those are not equally important things and the latter isn't developed or believable, but the movie does hum along at a pleasing pace with two strong performers doing pretty good work.
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Precious Doll » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:49 am

I was dreading this film (pushed it forward from a proposed Monday screening to today) and as clunky and amateurish as it largely was it was a very easy viewing experience. None of it rings true and we go from one cliche to the next for two hours. What does make it easy to watch is that Farrelly moves things along quickly (the 130 minutes speed by) and co-leads Mahershala Ali & Viggo Mortensen whilst giving rather broad performances are both very agreeable in the film and manage to rise above a sea of mediocracy. Can't help but give them credit for that because its easier for an actor to do great work in a great film that to do goodish work in a lesser film.

Still, the film including the actors have no business being considered for awards and this is the first film I have seen since Roma that had more than 10 people at the screening.
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby ITALIANO » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:31 am

Precious Doll wrote:
ITALIANO wrote:
Mister Tee wrote: In the recent Mary, Queen of Scots not only there are several black actors - and yes, in England and Scotland in those times there WERE black people, but not many - but some of these play roles of ambassadors, etc - high positions which a black man back then couldn't even dream of getting to. If we can't respect history in order to be "politically correct", we won't respect (and understand, and solve) today's problems, too. We will in a movie, or in an award show, but never for real.


Whilst Mary, Queen of Scots is only a film (and a shitty one at that I believe), I agree with you Italino.

https://www.bustle.com/p/the-color-blin ... y-13605399

If people want to see an accurate portrayal of just how coloured people were treated in Europe a couple of centuries ago look no further than Abedellatif Kechiche's Black Venus (2010). Admittedly, though based on a true story that is very unique individual I bet no white woman would have been subjected to the indignations inflicted on Saartjes Baartman.


It is definitely only a movie. But it says alot.

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Precious Doll » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:11 am

ITALIANO wrote:
Mister Tee wrote: In the recent Mary, Queen of Scots not only there are several black actors - and yes, in England and Scotland in those times there WERE black people, but not many - but some of these play roles of ambassadors, etc - high positions which a black man back then couldn't even dream of getting to. If we can't respect history in order to be "politically correct", we won't respect (and understand, and solve) today's problems, too. We will in a movie, or in an award show, but never for real.


Whilst Mary, Queen of Scots is only a film (and a shitty one at that I believe), I agree with you Italino.

https://www.bustle.com/p/the-color-blin ... y-13605399

If people want to see an accurate portrayal of just how coloured people were treated in Europe a couple of centuries ago look no further than Abedellatif Kechiche's Black Venus (2010). Admittedly, though based on a true story that is about a very unique individual I bet no white woman would have been subjected to the indignations inflicted on Saartjes Baartman.
Last edited by Precious Doll on Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby ITALIANO » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:45 am

Reza wrote:
ITALIANO wrote:For example the fact that lately each year there MUST be at least one black actor - or actress - among the four winners - deservedly or not deservedly. In the recent Mary, Queen of Scots not only there are several black actors - and yes, in England and Scotland in those times there WERE black people, but not many - but some of these play roles of ambassadors, etc - high positions which a black man back then couldn't even dream of getting to. If we can't respect history in order to be "politically correct", we won't respect (and understand, and solve) today's problems, too. We will in a movie, or in an award show, but never for real.


Shhhhh Italiano.....you will be called racist here for daring to mention that there is now an obsessive desire by the Academy to award a black actor every year :lol:


I have been called even worse things on this board (if there could be something worse). But I simply think that awards should only be given to those who deserve them. I am sure that movies - movies, not awards - should mirror a multi-ethnic society, and more movies should be made with black characters - preferably in believable, and not necessarily idealized, roles.

But then awards should go to the best - just this.

And, I mean... some of those here who complain about a possible Best Picture Oscar to Green Book... I haven't even seen it, but they don't understand that when you live in a myopic, simplified politically correct universe, that's the result. I don't want to go into this again but... well, read some of the reactions to my posts and you will understand what I mean.

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Reza » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:17 am

Mister Tee wrote:I think the film is clearly a retro piece -- setting it in 1962 is no excuse for adopting a 1962 mind-set on race in America.


I didn't quite understand this, Mister Tee. Are you saying that Green Book, although set in 1962, should have had a 2018 mind-set on race in America?

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Reza » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:11 am

ITALIANO wrote:For example the fact that lately each year there MUST be at least one black actor - or actress - among the four winners - deservedly or not deservedly. In the recent Mary, Queen of Scots not only there are several black actors - and yes, in England and Scotland in those times there WERE black people, but not many - but some of these play roles of ambassadors, etc - high positions which a black man back then couldn't even dream of getting to. If we can't respect history in order to be "politically correct", we won't respect (and understand, and solve) today's problems, too. We will in a movie, or in an award show, but never for real.


Shhhhh Italiano.....you will be called racist here for daring to mention that there is now an obsessive desire by the Academy to award a black actor every year :lol:

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby ITALIANO » Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:33 am

Mister Tee wrote: The biggest problem I have with all this is that it was specifically AIMED at bringing down an Oscar contender (talk about low stakes). The tweet was evidently uncovered and then sent viral by somebody at Awards Watch who objected to the movie's politics and set out to "take it down". People over there at the site are hooting and hollering "We won!", thinking they've single-handedly taken away an award from somebody. Some are shouting, Now on to Bohemian Rhapsody and Vice! Anything they don't like should be subject to villainization. This has the overlay of Madame De Farge at her knitting. ... I hate living in these times.


Same here. But I must add that when I pointed out that this was also one of the risks of the MeToo hysteria (not the principles, of course - the way they were generically and grossly expressed by the movement and by some on this board, and the way they could be wrongly used to defame someone) nobody admitted that I was right. And I mean, it's not like most people here don't know America (and its witch-hunting propensity) better than I do. But most were silent.

It's true that our judgement, for example, of a novel (of the artistic level of a novel) shouldn't be influenced by its writer's private life or political vuews or anything else which isn't in the novel itself. And the same must be applied to movies - even more so, actually, as a movie is a collaborative effort and the private opinions of just one of its makers definitely shouldn't influence our assessment of the movie in itself.

Yet, it's our duty to check if - in the novel, in the movie - those private opinions can be traced, either implicit or explicit. And if this is the case, that CAN influence (at least partly) our judgement, because a work of art must also be considered based on the message that it conveys. It's not the ONLY aspect we must consider of course - and it pales for instance whem, like in Leni Riefenstahl's documentaries, the formal and historical values are so overwhelming - but it's an important aspect nonetheless, one that we can't ignore. A work of art is also responsible of the ideology which it supports, like it or not.

Also - opinions, even private opinions, ARE facts. And in my life, while I would never end a friendship based on accusations, even nasty ones, unless they are really believable or, even better, proved, I would end a friendship based on opinions that I find unacceptable. But I'm afraid that in America it doesn't work this way.

(By the way, Mister Tee. I have bad news - not for you, but for your "not reactionary" friend. Yes, the one who "voted for Hillary and hates Trump". He IS a reactionary. Because if we believe absurd fake news, if we are convinced that we really saw them or that they really happened - it's because we WANT to believe them. Deep inside, we do. Next time you see him, for example at a musical, tell him so. Immediately. Directly. It's better to be honest with friends, always. I always act like this. You may lose his friendship, but remember - it will be a reactionary's friendship).

There are many reasons why like Mister Tee, I hate living in these times when it comes to the Oscars (and the Oscars, of course, mirror today's America). For example the fact that lately each year there MUST be at least one black actor - or actress - among the four winners - deservedly or not deservedly. In the recent Mary, Queen of Scots not only there are several black actors - and yes, in England and Scotland in those times there WERE black people, but not many - but some of these play roles of ambassadors, etc - high positions which a black man back then couldn't even dream of getting to. If we can't respect history in order to be "politically correct", we won't respect (and understand, and solve) today's problems, too. We will in a movie, or in an award show, but never for real.

There was a time when I thought that Trump was the "other side" of movies like, say, The Blind Side. Now I have realized that he's not the other side. He's the same side. Because idiocy - even well-meaning idiocy - is always idiotic, and a country or a culture that support idiocy (and this applies to a certain way of looking at the MeToo movement or of praising it, too) will end up making idiotic choices.
Last edited by ITALIANO on Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Green Book reviews

Postby Okri » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:17 pm



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